United3dArtists Archive

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 06 Feb 2010, 19:55

I thought i´d devote a seperat thread for that because a lot of people have it and its not common
knowledge that it has become a great NORMAL render engine too ! Both for tabletops or props or
renders from the inside of a building ! No landscape thing NADA !
I will share a few tricks as i am ading to this thread.....
What its got that makes it also special is that it supports displacement and now normal mapping...
And its fast with displacement. I´d actually love to run a speed contest withit against Vray and thea once thats out.
vue isnt fast with all the load like athmospheres and clouds and all the bells and whistles but if you trim it to just
simple render its fast. apart from that its got an incredible deep material editor.....
plus its standalone no need for an exporter....
Here are a few renders....(with displacement) took just a few seconds to render.....
second one shows dispersion from a single white lightsourcethrough a prisma..
Yes and no glass bug....
Peter

marcel · Post by **marcel** » 06 Feb 2010, 20:14

RAYMAN wrote:vue isnt fast with all the load like athmospheres and clouds and all the bells and whistles but if you trim it to just simple render its fast...

Vue seem as fast as other render engine. Try to render atmos, clouds and trees on other soft and all the render will be very slow too. Light source through a prisma is interesting but it is difficult to see how real is the diffraction of the white light. The best thing would be to create a real test with a real prism, take a photo and compare the same 3d scene created in the same circumstance to simulate the effect. It would be also a good thing to adjust the setting to be as real as possible. In any case, such functions are nice.

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 06 Feb 2010, 20:28

marcel wrote:
RAYMAN wrote:vue isnt fast with all the load like athmospheres and clouds and all the bells and whistles but if you trim it to just simple render its fast...
Vue seem as fast as other render engine. Try to render atmos, clouds and trees on other soft and all the render will be very slow too. Light source through a prisma is interesting but it is difficult to see how real is the diffraction of the white light. The best thing would be to create a real test with a real prism, take a photo and compare the same 3d scene created in the same circumstance to simulate the effect. It would be also a good thing to adjust the setting to be as real as possible. In any case, such functions are nice.

your right.. !
I recall that its not very different from the effect that you get from a real prisma....
But nice to see some other use is possiblen ten just landscaping....
Even the esprit version has the same global illumination render engine...

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 06 Feb 2010, 22:53

Here are some more renders none of them took longer then 15 minutes at 600x800 on a 2,5 year old quadcore..
even with over a thousand diamonds loaded as instance..

marcel · Post by **marcel** » 06 Feb 2010, 23:18

I imagine the diamonds with caustic and difraction of the light...
what i like is a standalone render. i don't like to use an exporter for the render. I think it is impossible to work correctly because when i work, i do a model, then i try a render, then i modify the model and try again a new render, etc.... i do model, shader, setting of the render engine together. It would be stupid to import/export each minute a new model, then do texture on the off line render to see that it is not perfect. It is an enormous lack of time. On big companie they have several people, one for the model, one for the texture and one for the render. in this case, an external render engine is not a problem. When you work alone the need is totally different.

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 07 Feb 2010, 00:18

marcel wrote:I imagine the diamonds with caustic and difraction of the light...
what i like is a standalone render. i don't like to use an exporter for the render. I think it is impossible to work correctly because when i work, i do a model, then i try a render, then i modify the model and try again a new render, etc.... i do model, shader, setting of the render engine together. It would be stupid to import/export each minute a new model, then do texture on the off line render to see that it is not perfect. It is an enormous lack of time. On big companie they have several people, one for the model, one for the texture and one for the render. in this case, an external render engine is not a problem. When you work alone the need is totally different.

Theres actually a very smart function in vue thats called replace... theres 2 versions of it. If you model in whatever modeler it is adviasable to save what you have done....
while your modeling you can leave vue open and hit replace and your model gets replaced with the same model but a newer version its almost like the synchronised
modeler and layout of Lightwave......
When you click on the image below you will see it jump from old to new...

LeonRegis · Post by **LeonRegis** » 07 Feb 2010, 01:17

That's amazing but I want to see a better glass I just think that the diamonds are just great and with caustics would look even better, but the glass are just too unrealistic, I would prefer the vray glass with the glass bug.

DanX · Post by **DanX** » 07 Feb 2010, 01:36

Yes Vue is a good rendering app although I am not sure it is as good as some of the images I have seen from MR and even Modo’s native render engine. Thea looks like it is going to be incredible I just hope I can afford it.

I am not qualified to make such a statement but I believe Vue is just as capable as most of the high dollar render engines on the market although it may not be as fast. Only it has much more to it than just render ability. And like Rayman says if I import a model that I am UV mapping and I change the mesh or the UV’s and save it in any modeler that exports a format that Vue will read. It will update every time I save over the previous file for that model as long as the name is not changed. Vue will even tell you by the way of a popup message that the mesh you have loaded has been changed by an outside application and ask if you want to replace it with the newer version.

I have even animated models by rendering then reloading frame by frame. It is very slow and a pain but the only way I could get an Ik animation out of TS before Collada.

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 07 Feb 2010, 03:37

Exactly Dan ! What I am saying here is nothing else then if you have Vue dont hesitate to use it for your non landscape work its pretty fast maybe not as fast as the fatest
but its difficult to judge because its got quite lot of things that you can turn off or tweak to get much shorter render times.......
Dont always judge from pics that you see on the net theres a lot of possibility to tweak things.....
here you see a few other glass renders leon.. notice that the look isnt the same .. you can get a lot of variation its upon the user to get the results you want.....
Peter

LeonRegis · Post by **LeonRegis** » 07 Feb 2010, 10:25

We need a applause emoticon! But for now... THAT'S GLASS!

DanX · Post by **DanX** » 07 Feb 2010, 13:00

I was rendering some glass to post and fell asleep last night

but found the same things. There are several lighting models with the atmosphere that are incredibly powerful. And then the textures can be edited to react to light in many different ways. Like water, smoke, fire, wet dirt, dry dirt, paint, skin and the list goes on and on. It is truly up to the artist and their knowledge of light and how to get Vue to do what they want.

It scares me to think of what someone like Prodigy could do with Vue.

One tip for you Peter is turn off all the effects like wind in your environment editor and turn off everything you don’t need in your render settings. You can even save your own custom render settings and then load them when you need them or share them with someone less fortunate in the intelligence department like myself .

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 07 Feb 2010, 13:54

DanX wrote:I was rendering some glass to post and fell asleep last night but found the same things. There are several lighting models with the atmosphere that are incredibly powerful. And then the textures can be edited to react to light in many different ways. Like water, smoke, fire, wet dirt, dry dirt, paint, skin and the list goes on and on. It is truly up to the artist and their knowledge of light and how to get Vue to do what they want.

It scares me to think of what someone like Prodigy could do with Vue.

One tip for you Peter is turn off all the effects like wind in your environment editor and turn off everything you don’t need in your render settings. You can even save your own custom render settings and then load them when you need them or share them with someone less fortunate in the intelligence department like myself .

Hi Dan I have my own render settings for quite some time they are tweaked from some of what i got from the Cornucopia site.
Each of them is for a different purpose but they all speed up the process quite a bit ....(I will share them)
Thats the purpose of this thread.....one can save your settings in a file and share them same as enviroments with Hdri....!

Peter
PS.:I actually noticed that the renders from the demo scenes were lightning fast.... well you alread got some good startpoint for your own render settings !

LeonRegis · Post by **LeonRegis** » 07 Feb 2010, 14:42

Vue is my favorite now, next step: Buy it... Estimated time: 2 to 10 years.

pugman 1 · Post by **pugman 1** » 07 Feb 2010, 15:14

Hi leon , in 10 years i dont think you will buy vue

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 07 Feb 2010, 15:39

Ok lets get into some settings now ... here are some scene files that use an area light thats probably the simplest setup.
If you use the light area setup you can delete the area light and just run ibl with it. You also get tweaked render settings for use with area light and ones
with blurred rfeflected textures (higher antialiasing) - dont use the last one for normal setup !
made for Vue 8 but should also work for PLE version 8 (so everyone can follow)
Peter

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 07 Feb 2010, 16:55

Here are product rendering setups that are pretty fast .
They are scene files !
The Titanic model has 356238 polygons and rendered with the low setting in 8,8 sec on a quadcore 2,4 with 3gig ram (2-3 year old)
at medium setting it took 38 seconds. All for the size of 600x800 px.

pugman 1 · Post by **pugman 1** » 07 Feb 2010, 17:13

This seems like a good render programe, what i
would like to know is which one it is ,
There are 5 or 6 versions of vue 8

thanks Ralph

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 07 Feb 2010, 17:30

pugman 1 wrote:This seems like a good render programe, what i
would like to know is which one it is ,
There are 5 or 6 versions of vue 8
thanks Ralph

They are all the same Ralph !
they are all built on the same core engine they just differ in what features you got.
you can ad the features one by one but those simple renders can be made with the Esprit version upwards....
heck you could even do it with pioneer if you can import the model with the import module....
You can even do it with the 4 year old Vue 5 version but you cant load the version 8 files.....
but you can load the Vue5 files with version 8 ... same as with Truespace 7.61 isnt backwards compatible with 7.6....
I tried to render the Titanic with Lightwork but Truespasce crashes when you load the obj. with luuv.
3ds file also crashes....... I got it to import with Frootees obj importer into workspace that took it in 10 seconds and i had it in workspace pretty nicely but couldnt get it over ther bridge its still calculating

pugman 1 · Post by **pugman 1** » 07 Feb 2010, 18:10

Thanks, good to know ,i have had my
eye on vue for a while just dont know which
version to get, thanks for the info

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 07 Feb 2010, 18:49

your welcome Pugman !
I finally got the thing loaded into model side and rendered in Lightworks...
Here is the render done with lightworks with ibl and 1 infinite light.
The render took 36,8 seconds on the same size and configuration Vue used....
on this scene Lightworks takes as long as Vue while Vue is global illu and lightworks isnt.....
Vue rendered on the workspace side and took about 10 seconds but the textures were screwed up and showed no nice gi
i think if you want to get nice gi you have to crank it up too !
Peter
Here is the lightworks render...

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 07 Feb 2010, 21:46

Ok I tried to render th scene in different enviroments..... Modo ... Lightwave...... Kerkythea.
Modo didt open the filewas to big ! Lightwave opened and rendered it and was pretty fast about 10 seconds with GI but chopped the bottom of the boat into pieces and wasnt smooth.... Kerky rendered with fast setting photon mapping in 10 seconds and wikth middle setting 16 seconds all at 600 x800

pugman 1 · Post by **pugman 1** » 08 Feb 2010, 14:39

Hi all, vue 8 pioneer is free , i just dowloaded
it over 500 mb. registed and activated it
no watermarks, now i must learn how to use it.
Ralph

pugman 1 · Post by **pugman 1** » 08 Feb 2010, 15:32

Sorry no water marks but a small logo
at the bottem right of the finnished render

LeonRegis · Post by **LeonRegis** » 08 Feb 2010, 15:37

What you mean by free? '-'

pugman 1 · Post by **pugman 1** » 08 Feb 2010, 15:39

does not cost you money

LeonRegis · Post by **LeonRegis** » 08 Feb 2010, 15:54

It's a complete version just with small logo on render or it's demo/trial? It's the vue or it's just vue render engine? Why did they launch it free?

v3rd3 · Post by **v3rd3** » 08 Feb 2010, 16:18

So you could learn the basics and salivate over spending the money for the upgrades.....

I bought Vue8 complete ... I did not have the budget for Infinite...

pugman 1 · Post by **pugman 1** » 08 Feb 2010, 16:21

Leon its the full program with a restriction on model
export .go to the vue site and there you can read
what you want to know

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 08 Feb 2010, 20:59

It does have a catch you cant import models from outside you need an importer !
But like i said the esprit version comes with that and you can alos use it for commercial work !
Peter

DanX · Post by **DanX** » 08 Feb 2010, 21:34

I have a question Peter?

Do you own stock in Vue ?

Just kidding! I agree it is a great tool one of the best. I wish it was not so expensive but if all of us TS users buy it it will probably be free within a year HAHA.

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 09 Feb 2010, 00:02

DanX wrote:I have a question Peter? Do you own stock in Vue ?

Just kidding! I agree it is a great tool one of the best. I wish it was not so expensive but if all of us TS users buy it it will probably be free within a year HAHA.

You see i would it wouldnt even be bad invested but tzhe point is the availability of what one can use apart from Truespace itself boils down to
standalone versions and the few things that we have an exporter for. not very big options ; )
Plus it has to be in a price range that people can afford it so lots of options drop out.....
But i will also get vray standalone once its affordable and of any use...... I am not a big friend of the old TS Vray... but would be of standalone.. !
Peter

DanX · Post by **DanX** » 10 Feb 2010, 02:55

It seems a lot of software out there is getting better. Pretty soon we will have such a large choice that the prices will drop drastically. I think we just need to learn to use what we have and see what the future brings in the way of options.

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 10 Feb 2010, 14:20

DanX wrote:It seems a lot of software out there is getting better. Pretty soon we will have such a large choice that the prices will drop drastically. I think we just need to learn to use what we have and see what the future brings in the way of options.

Thats the purpose of this thread Dan... a lot of people have it and only use it for landscapes which is not all it can do......
The pix show that there isnt much of a difference from one Gi solution to the other.... its basically what the user sets up....... thats the point I´m making !

DanX · Post by **DanX** » 11 Feb 2010, 20:24

Point well made Peter. I still think Vue is one of the better software packages out there for what we are using it for. It is way more versatile than most people know and I think you should keep posting about it because for the price it cant be beat for what it delivers. Just using Vue 5 and Xara X I built many battle maps for MW4 a few years back. If you plan on doing any type of 3D work it’s a tool you should consider. Heck you can even use external render engines as well. I would post more about all the things I have done with it but I am swamped with the work I already have and don’t have much time to post.

Please don’t take offence with my lame humor. I tend to get in trouble a lot because of it. For instance at work a woman supervisor yells at me for running over the bristles of a broom leaning against the wall with my pallet jack. Well before I thought about what I was saying I told her not to worry it would probably still fly! For some reason we became friends later but at the time she didn’t think it was very funny.

And please continue to post your images I love to see your work.

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 12 Feb 2010, 15:10

DanX wrote:
Please don’t take offence with my lame humor. I tend to get in trouble a lot because of it. For instance at work a woman supervisor yells at me for running over the bristles of a broom leaning against the wall with my pallet jack. Well before I thought about what I was saying I told her not to worry it would probably still fly! For some reason we became friends later but at the time she didn’t think it was very funny.
.

Peter

marcel · Post by **marcel** » 13 Feb 2010, 12:18

Now vue 8 speak german and french! It is a good new for me. i am tired to learn english soft because i have no time for that (i know well TS, it is not a problem with this soft). It was annoying because Vue was a french soft at the begining.
Peter: what is the difference between Vue 8 and vue 8 pioneer ?

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 13 Feb 2010, 13:35

marcel wrote:Now vue 8 speak german and french! It is a good new for me. i am tired to learn english soft because i have no time for that (i know well TS, it is not a problem with this soft). It was annoying because Vue was a french soft at the begining.
Peter: what is the difference between Vue 8 and vue 8 pioneer ?

Vue 8 pioneer is a free version that is made as a teaser to show you how it works and what quality you would get but you cant import your
own models you would need the espit version as a lowest to import ...
Here is the comparison table...
http://www.e-onsoftware.com/products/vu ... it/?page=9"
Dont forget you can get each module extra so you dont have to buy the preconfigured packs
like if you want esprit and ecosystem..
Peter

LeonRegis · Post by **LeonRegis** » 13 Feb 2010, 13:46

Render up is the render engine? So pioneer don't have a render engine?

DanX · Post by **DanX** » 13 Feb 2010, 13:50

Wonder what Marcel’s electric storm tornado would look like in Vue ? I should try that some day but for now busy studying other stuff.

marcel · Post by **marcel** » 13 Feb 2010, 14:06

Thank Peter. I didn't know it is possible to buy separately each modules. I think esprit and ecosystem is what i would like to have first. Is there a link to see all the modules with a little explanation and price?

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 13 Feb 2010, 17:45

marcel wrote:Thank Peter. I didn't know it is possible to buy separately each modules. I think esprit and ecosystem is what i would like to have first. Is there a link to see all the modules with a little explanation and price?

Here you go Marcel !
http://www.e-onsoftware.com/products/vu ... on#modules"

and here is the feature list of esprit and when necessary also what modules you would require to get more specs..
http://www.e-onsoftware.com/products/vu ... it/?page=7"

here is ecosystem and on the left you see a link to all the other modules
http://www.e-onsoftware.com/products/vu ... =ecosystem"

I would download the free Vue 8 Inf. PLE version which is free and play with it for some time you will see what modulesyou will want to have
The PLE is only limited by making a watermark and its for non comercial work.
http://www.e-onsoftware.com/products/?page=try"
Peter

LeonRegis · Post by **LeonRegis** » 13 Feb 2010, 18:36

Here is what I would add to Vue 8 Esprit:

LightTune
KronosFX
Ecosystem

If I have more money:

EcoPainter (seems good, right?)
Zephyr (Realism in animations is always welcome)

What you guys would do?

And about Vue 8 in general, how does it creates models? It's good like tS? Simple UI?

Thanks in Advance

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 13 Feb 2010, 18:56

leonregis wrote:Here is what I would add to Vue 8 Esprit:

LightTune
KronosFX
Ecosystem

If I have more money:

EcoPainter (seems good, right?)
Zephyr (Realism in animations is always welcome)

What you guys would do?

And about Vue 8 in general, how does it creates models? It's good like tS? Simple UI?

Thanks in Advance

Leon it isnt a modeler but all the other things it can do very well its actually a suplement to Truespace something like a pluginpackage
that we will probably never get for Truespace any more like treegenerator or instancing and terraincreation etc.
(things that ie Carrara has)
If you want to see what you will possibly like to have try out the free PLE and see what modules will be important for you.
It might be a better deal to get a combination package like studio or complete just look at all the charts before you buy...
I even find the Ui better because you got a stack and layers and can group and name and access textures very easily......
Plus that proplem with your skysphere isnt a problem anymore you just import it and it works..
Peter

LeonRegis · Post by **LeonRegis** » 13 Feb 2010, 19:02

Yeah it seems amazing and it's what I'll buy if I have enough money.

It seems good to animation, how it runs about animation? The render engine is fast on rendering?

Thanks

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 13 Feb 2010, 22:47

It imports Truespace animations very nicely and also Poser and a lot more tat you can move with Collada.
Daz also works well ... I devoted a whole thread in the genral section so look at samples there
Speed is pretty good if you strip out the heavy stuff but it can render stuff that other solutions cant..
Peter

LeonRegis · Post by **LeonRegis** » 13 Feb 2010, 22:56

A read the animation features and seems pretty good, so I mean if it's good to you to create the animation inside Vue or it's better to import it?

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 13 Feb 2010, 22:59

keyframing is better in Vue but character animations are best in the free daz studio and imported from there to Vue....
You have something like a morphing pad...
vi ... f=4&t=1142"

vi ... &hilit=vue"
vi ... &hilit=vue"
Peter

pugman 1 · Post by **pugman 1** » 11 Jul 2010, 09:56

Hi just purchased Vue esprit , been learning pioneer for the last 5 months
preety good .now i will get 1 module a mouth till complete
i also want to get carrera 8 pro, upgrade from 7 pro 195 euros
also poser 8 and daz advanced . ithink when i have them all
every thing is posible for what i do or would like to do.
and of course ts workspace for modling
no need for maya or max i am not a film maker or in the 3D buisness

DanX · Post by **DanX** » 28 Sep 2010, 12:32

I have to wonder if Vue will jump on the GPU render wagon? Seems everyone is or has plans to in the future. I also would have to ask if it would make much difference because Vue already has a pretty fast preview?

RAYMAN · Post by **RAYMAN** » 01 Oct 2010, 21:45

Sooner or later I think they must.
The question is what will be the system on which it will run...
There may be a seperate version for that though.
Peter

Math Path · Post by **Math Path** » 02 Oct 2010, 12:52

Hi,
actually you can get all editions Vue8 for artists at half of price, what is good news, I think.
This is their offer until October 15, 2010

http://www.e-onsoftware.com/about/flash ... hance.html

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