How long should a set of frames go on for a smooth animation

[tamtam]

Like the title says:
How long should a set of frames go on for a smooth animation?

I'd like to know this because I have Truespace, Maya (2009 for now), and something called iClone by Reallusion. My mini movies I make in iClone, for example, always seem too fast to even see what's going on in the mini movie. So, say for example I have started at frame 1, then where would I end an animation clip for a slower, smoother animation clip, which doesn't go so fast?

I suppose the same frame start and end points would be the same for smoother animation in any animation software.

But then again, what would I do if I wanted something in an animation to look like it's going faster? Motion blur? A smaller amount of frames? What if I want one object to go slow, then the other to go fast?

Thanks for the help.

[froo]

Hi tamtam. Good to see you here!

A reasonable assumption is, 30 frames of animation per second.
So, if you want a 10 second animation, you need 300 frames of animation.

For fast animation, you want an object to traverse a long distance, in a short amount of time: travel 900 units, in 30 frames:

900 meters / 30 frames = 30 meters / frame (very fast motion)

For slow aniamtion, you want an object to traverse a short distance, in a long amount of time: travel 9 units, in 300 frames:

9 meters / 300 frames = 0.03 meters / frame (very slow motion)

[v3rd3]

If you go back in animation history the film length animations from the late 30's, like Fleisher Studios "Gulliver's Travels", were hand drawn at 32 fps. As the animations got longer and the production costs went higher that dropped to 30, 24 and eventually as low as 16 fps for Saturday morning television cartoons.

As Froo has pointed out if you are looking for very smooth animations 30 is a great place to be but consider the economy of what you are doing as well. Remember that when you start working at 30 fps you have to stay there for the duration of your piece.

Another point of selling smooth, fast or any other motion dynamic you want to present is to exaggerate the movement by varying the pace. If you watch the great animators work you will see things like a baseball pitcher winding up before he throws.. the windup could be frantic(leading indicator of something fast), then he freezes completely while he pauses to look at the catchers mitt(creates suspense), then the pitcher stretches back to throw and stops at maximum stretch for a fraction of a second then throws his body forward to the other extreme of stretching... to really sell the speed you never see the ball leave his hand or fly to the plate.... all you see is a blur.

The drama that you add to your shots as well as the careful use of posing change the audience perception of everything.

If you really want to see great animation technique Warner Brothers, Disney Classics et al are wonderful places to study.

Most of the animation on prime time TV (Family Guy, etc) are successful because of their writing and sense of comedy more than the animations skillz of the studios producing them (sorry,,, just my humble opinion). You can see the elements of classical technique in some of their early incarnations but as soon as they start using 3d software and modern production facilities they lose the "stretch".

That's it for now...

I think Dele and a few of the regulars on the Cali forum had some great links to free training at some animation schools that were posted in the forums. If I can dig some of them up I will post them here when I get a chance.. They taught me a great deal in a short period of time.

There is also an ebook which I will try to find for you originally written in the 50's I think... I believe it is now in the public domain its just a matter of finding it.

More later.

[Steinie]

Froo is correct that in the U.S. the sweet spot is 30 fps.
The confusion starts with the fact that in the past we used Shutter Speeds of a camera. Where today
we can use any speed we want to create slow motion or to speed up a motion. Add more movement within
your 30 FPS to show speed and less movement to show slow motion. (I assume you are talking about 3D rendering.)
Plan on how much movement is wanted when rendering within a certain time and adjust in post production.

In the past when we used a film camera, speeding up the film or slowing down the fps created the look we desired.


In the past Amateur film to NTSC video transfer rate of 23.976 FPS was used or 25 FPS for PAL.
Since we are digital today I would stick to 30 FPS.

[LeonRegis]

30 is the best, however I did one at 24 and it went pretty good, as I saved some time

[marcel]

Most of standard are from old analogic tv with afterglow .On computer you can do what you want but, more the screen is good and more you need fps. Today the smooth movment depend of the hardware. On cinema, the frame need a very good motion blur at 24 fps. it is enought for DVD. A 100 hertz tv can calculate new frame between two frame in realtime. I use a hd cam at 50 fps interlaced. then deinterlace at 25 pfs progressive and the result is very good on computer because the motion blur in each frame is the average of two frame (as 100 hertz tv do).
Quality of the picture is most important than fps. If you can imagine the movment of an object in a still image (because a good motion blur render) probably the movie will have a smooth animation.

[Prodigy]

Let's explain a bit what is how the Frames per second works, so you will understand and will decide by yourself..

There are 2 voltages on the world.. 110v on North America and 220v for the rest of the world..

110v is 60 hertz..
220v is 50 hertz..

Any image is composed by rows of pixels.. even and odds.. Any tv signal is interlaced. so the tv shows you just the half of information..
LCD support now Progressive scan that shows you the even and odd frames at once, giving a much clean image..

OK, let's back to the hertz.. if you divide the 60hertz you will have 30 right?

30hz for the even lines, and 30hz for the odd lines.. so there you have 30fps

The same with the 220v. 50hz divided by 2, gives you 25hz...~ 25fps..

30 Frames for NTSC (USA)
25 Frames for PAL (n, c, m, etc..etc..)

Why 24 frames per second for cinema??

Well, the explanation is simple.. the human eye can see 12 frames per second.. so with the double (24) is just enough to see a smooth movie..

Add more frames than 24 will give a much smoother image.. so how many frames per second?? will depend on the output format.. pal, ntsc or cinema... nothing else than that..

HTH

[brotherx]

You should also consider that these days the majority of folks will be able to watch 60hz pictures on HD tvs or on their PC as well as the 50Hz ones so it really doesn't matter any more. On a PC or for HD, 30 is good and if you're putting your stuff on a DVD, most players can adjust the playback to 25fps as well, if needed. Same goes the other way.